Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (lists)
{{WikiProject banner shell}}
to this page and add the quality rating to that template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.Lists Project‑class | |||||||
|
This page was nominated for merging with Wikipedia:Stand-alone lists#Titles on 28 September 2008. The result of the discussion (permanent link) was to merge. |
List of foo: A
This seems to be the most commonly used format:
- List of people by name: A
- List of places by name: A
- List of acronyms and initialisms: A
- List of songs by name: A
- List of drugs: A
- List of books by title: A
- List of airports: A
-- Reinyday, 03:09, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
- I prefer List of foo: A as well. I doubt that this will need to come down to a poll, but with little discussion as of yet one can't tell. -Sean Curtin 21:22, September 1, 2005 (UTC)
- If this is the most popular, then I'd say the consensus has already formed on this convention. Hiding talk 08:08, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
Spanning Lists
While we're at it, we may as well discuss how to do it if the list spans categories:
- List of foo: A-B
- List of foo: A - B
- List of foo: A to B
- I would vote for the first. Chuck 15:04, 22 September 2005 (UTC)
- I will be using the first option on New Hampshire Historical Markers Jokermage "Timor Mentum Occidit" 07:59, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
- Support the first. Rich Farmbrough 20:55 25 February 2006 (UTC).
- Support first --Donar Reiskoffer 08:14, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
- Conflicts sharply with WP:MOS: en-dashes, not hyphens, are used to indicate ranges. Adjusted the text to account for this. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:18, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
I was also thinking about a navigational template that would group like the buttons of a telephone:
- List of foo: A-B-C
- ...
- List of foo: W-X-Y-Z
would work much better than the other proposed choices. So count me in for the first. --Francis Schonken 08:48, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
- {{CompactTOC8}} has long since surpassed this; virtually everything about it is customizable. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:18, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Discussion over "List of mammals in (or of) Foo" articles
A discussion has started at Wikipedia:Village pump (assistance)#List naming dispute: "in" vs. "of" about whether "List of mammals of Foo" or "List of mammals in Foo" is more appropriate. The discussion brings up broader points about how Wikipedia editors should name lists. Interested editors, please comment there. Noroton (talk) 21:01, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
- Actually, WP:CFD and various other fora have long settled this issue; it's "of", not "in", since "in-ness" can be temporary. For example, if I bring a Chinese giant salamander to Texas for a week of exhibition, it is an amphibian in Texas, but certainly not of that area. Anyway, this is why we have Category:Politics of Germany, not Category:Politics in Germany, and many, many other such categories and articles. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:23, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Substantive update
This was a good start, but it's just been sitting here not being improved and not keeping up with what's actually happening, and even in places conflicting with other guidelines. I've overhauled it for all of the following:
- Typos and grammar fixed
- Unclear wording rewritten
- Ranting, excessively longwinded near-attack on a Bach article trimmed and toned down
- Missing basic advice added
- How NCLL relates to other guidelines explained
- Compressed redundant material into a simple-to-absorb preferred style
- Documented how exceptions have worked, and why
- Consistent style used in the guideline prose
- Removed self-contradiction
- Updated for more capable templates
- Fixed abuse of tables and other markup
- Toned down the constant use of bold and italics
- Many usability points added
- Reduced off-topic chatter
- Linking and crossreferences added
- Better sectionalization performed
- Improved logic flow
- More of an intro written
- Directly deprecated ambiguous and otherwise user-hateful naming style
- Lots more.
If there are any substantive objections to anything, please discuss it here rather that going on some blanket revert. This was a lot of work, and I think every aspect of it can stand (or be challenged) on its own merits. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:30, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- WP:Article series was a closely-related guideline, then was demoted and marked as disputed in May, then was recently re-promoted, and I reverted back down to essay. Folks agree it's not ready for primetime, and there's overlap with this page. This is material I'm not familiar with, but I thought I'd pass this along in case you want to grab any material from there. One editor indicated he may work on that page and try to re-promote. - Dan Dank55 (send/receive) 01:20, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- Probably worth working on. I don't see much that is useful to port into here, since this is an NC page, not a style or content guide. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 10:15, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
- I see Francis substituted the current version of the example article for McCandlish's specific version; Francis makes a good point that the issues seem integral to the article as it currently stands, but even if it's okay here, I think it sets a bad example to use a moving target as an example for a naming convention. Thoughts? - Dan Dank55 (send/receive) 13:07, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- Agreed. Two problems with doing this (one of which I tried to address by linking to a specific version of the article, and the other by toning down the assault a bit) is that the example will be invalid eventually, as the article is improved, and also that the editors of the article are likely to feel that their work is being attacked and made an example of. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 10:04, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
- I see Francis substituted the current version of the example article for McCandlish's specific version; Francis makes a good point that the issues seem integral to the article as it currently stands, but even if it's okay here, I think it sets a bad example to use a moving target as an example for a naming convention. Thoughts? - Dan Dank55 (send/receive) 13:07, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Naming conventions for lists
A discussion has been opened at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions#Naming conventions for lists regarding the titles of lists. It is there so there isn't two threads here and at Wikipedia talk:Stand-alone lists. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 21:56, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Proposed move and merge
- The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
- The result of this discussion was articles merged. WhirlWithoutEnd (talk) 00:29, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
I propose moving this to Wikipedia:Naming conventions (lists), WP:NCLIST, and merging in the naming-related material from WP:SAL, since that is a style guideline. There is already a section here on lists in general, so that is where this material would go. WP:NCLL and its longer name would redirect to the new name. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 22:55, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
- Sounds good. - Dan Dank55 (send/receive) 23:53, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
- I'd support that. It's ridiculous that there is more than one page dealing with this and that have different guidelines. Do you propose adding something along the lines of what was said at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions#Naming conventions for lists? I'd support that, too. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 05:53, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
- Yes, go for it. Plus, I think that this page needs some improvements. Eklipse (talk) 12:33, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
- I'd support that. It's ridiculous that there is more than one page dealing with this and that have different guidelines. Do you propose adding something along the lines of what was said at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions#Naming conventions for lists? I'd support that, too. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 05:53, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
- This got forgotten about; someone just re-tagged the section MOS:SAL#Naming conventions for merge here. I don't see any objections in over 3 years, so I suggest we proceed before we forget again! :-) I volunteer to sandbox a merged page. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒〈°⌊°〉 Contribs. 04:04, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
- I would not merge it into to WP:NCLL... as that is explicitly for long lists. I would create a new guideline WP:Title conventions (lists and indexes) (I suggest "Title conventions" to bring it into line with the policy, WP:Article titles... we really should get rid of the term "naming conventions" completely, but one step at a time.) Blueboar (talk) 15:45, 7 October 2012 (UTC)
Splitting up a long list into sub-lists - comments welcome
Comments are invited on whether the very long List of alumni of Jesus College, Oxford should have sub-lists created, and if so, how. The discussion is at Talk:List of alumni of Jesus College, Oxford#Time to split into sub-lists?. BencherliteTalk 07:07, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
"List of foos: People" or "List of foos: people"?
At WP:FLC, some discussions have recently taken place on whether a sub-list should use a capital letter after the colon or inside the bracket (e.g. whether it should be a capital "p" in "List of foos (People)" or "List of foos: People"). The examples given on the convention page here would seem to suggest that the capital letter is to be used even when the sublist does not start with a proper noun e.g. "List of foos: Physics and chemistry". The discussions arise, in part, from my previous (unanswered) post on this page, directly above, but have arisen in other list discussions too. Are people happy that the convention is accurate, or should only proper nouns take a capital letter, for grammatical accuracy? BencherliteTalk 00:20, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
- I believe the statements made at Colon_(punctuation)#Use_of_capitals are correct regarding sentence case after colons, and I've also checked in reference books I have that are not used to reference the article, which back up those statements. Page titles should absolutely follow the correct grammar of the English language. They are the first thing people read; if we can't even get that right, what the hell is wrong with us? Matthewedwards : Chat 05:28, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
- Real example=List of United States Military Academy alumni (Superintendents). Should S be upper or lower? I say upper as Superintendent of the Academy is an official position. — Rlevse • Talk • 09:55, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
- I would agree with that. BencherliteTalk 19:37, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
- Real example=List of United States Military Academy alumni (Superintendents). Should S be upper or lower? I say upper as Superintendent of the Academy is an official position. — Rlevse • Talk • 09:55, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
Name suggestions requested
List of World War I flying aces is being cut up into more manageable sublists, but so far the sublists don't have what I consider to be the best names (World War I aces credited with 5 victories: Names beginning with G - Q for example). Are there any suggestions for more proper titles? - Trevor MacInnis (Contribs) 05:18, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
Arbitration request
Please could we have a third party rule on which of the following is preferred:
See User talk:Skittleys#Spurious caps. — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 18:14, 2 October 2009 (UTC)
Football player lists when split
An RfC has begun on the WT:FOOTY#Name of football player lists page regarding proper naming. Sandman888 (talk) 19:54, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
Template:List of Arcade Video Games Navbox has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Frietjes (talk) 17:38, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
List of symphonies by number example (Special cases section)
See Template talk:Symphonies by number and name#Disambiguation pages?. --Francis Schonken (talk) 14:27, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Missing advice: Don't create a "master" page for a split list without significant content
Some narrow advice on this been in MOS:GLOSSARIES for years, but is missing here at the more general guideline. This proposed text is for the "Long (split) list naming recommendations" section, and should go immediately above "Models (see examples below)".
- If the page centralizes significant and lengthy introductory information that is not practical to include in all the sub-articles, it is permissible to have a "List of foos" index article for the list series; otherwise this title should redirect to the first article in the series (e.g. "List of foos: A-C" in this example).
- If the page indexes a complex series of list articles arranged sectionally or with names that do not form a single series, it should be at "Lists of foos" or a similar title .
- If the page provides significant background, historical, or other non-list (and not just list-introductory) material, then it should be merged into the main article for the topic (or become that main article in absence of one), at "Foo", or at "Foo (disambiguating term)" if necessary.
{{main list}}
template; in a infobox parameter for certain types of lists (episode lists, discographies, etc.); in the "See also" section; in a Navbox; by working a piped link to the list into the regular article prose; or a combination of any of these.[End of proposed addition.]
This represents actual practice, so it should be in the guideline (some additional copyediting notwithstanding). — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 14:56, 16 December 2017 (UTC)